Tie rods

Wheel, tiller and autopilots
mahnamahna
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 4:48 pm
Location: Gosford NSW

Tie rods

Post by mahnamahna » Fri Jun 20, 2008 5:08 am

Its been a bit quiet on the forum this past week, so heres a topic that interests me at the moment. Tie rods in steering systems. What is the general consensus? I think that tie rods make steering systems a bit simpler to create, only 1 rudder needs to have an emergency manual tiller attachment point (assuming you have wheel steer as your normal method) and you can steer both rudders manually from one tiller, also you only need to attach a steering system (manual or hydraulic) to the tie rod rather than directly to each rudder. BUT, if your steering jams it jams both rudders, unless you have a method of detaching the tie rod and a tiller attachment on both rudders. I dont know much about hydraulics but I am told that if you have a hydraulic failure it also affects both rudders so perhaps this is not such a problem or at least common to both. So other than the need to have a straight place for the tie rod to run (sometimes not as easy as it sounds, my boat has a curved duckboard!) what are the other drawbacks if any? What is the thinking?

madaz
Posts: 527
Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2007 7:47 am
Location: Hobart, Tasmania

Tie rods

Post by madaz » Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:28 am

I have a thick walled alloy pipe wrapped in carbon fibre for a connecting bar.

I have two fabricated ends which have a thread on them which a tie rod screws onto, that allows for a balljoint type connection to each tiller, i havent hooked it up permanantly yet but it works well in trials.



I am not using hydraulic steering, just the good old Teleflex cable suitable for outboards upto V6. Cheap, well proven and pleanty of spares about.

northerncat
Posts: 849
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 5:55 pm
Location: cairns
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Tie rods

Post by northerncat » Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:45 am

mines articulated like james but with teleflex steering which im quite sold on now



sean

Whimsical
Posts: 370
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:01 pm
Location: Fremantle W.A.

Tie rods

Post by Whimsical » Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:09 pm

Paul

Have been spending lots of boat units.

I have been looking at the steeing and I cant see how a link would work with the rudder post 900mm aft of the last cross bulkhead, this would make the tiller too long and I wont have anything to conceal the rod unless the tiller goes through the bulkhead which makes the tiller even longer. We both will have the motor in this space also which makes it impossible without multiple links.

I have gone for a dual cylinder Hydrive with valves to isolate each cylinder if shit happens. Modern hydralics are very reliable and, from what I have read, far more dependable than mechanical systems. 3 boat bucks, bugger.



Mike

44c
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Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:08 am
Location: Hervey Bay, Qld

Tie rods

Post by 44c » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:05 pm

If you completely lost the hydraulics, steering one rudder by tiller would do the job. Might not be perfect, but it would work.



I'm having at least two helm pumps, and two cylinders, so with isolation valves, a failure of any part of the system would still leave me with at least one working helm, and/or one steerable rudder. (Although I might have to bleed air out first)

Smooth Cruiser
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Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 1:51 am
Location: Brisbane

Tie rods

Post by Smooth Cruiser » Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:33 pm

Going back to the original post - tie rods and disadvantages.



If you have an exposed tie rod outside the back beam, then it is highly likely that the dinghy will rest against it when it is up in the davits. To stop the dinghy swinging you need to secure it tightly which is difficult without binding the tie rod. Some thought around this difficulty in the build stage would allow a workable solution to be built in - buffer pads that stick out past the tie rod that the dinghy is pulled tightly to for example.

mahnamahna
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 4:48 pm
Location: Gosford NSW

Tie rods

Post by mahnamahna » Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:19 pm

If your tie rod is steel (SS or Galv) tube then a slightly oversize PVC tube (glassed on to boat and completely encased in glass to stop it cracking if hit) over it so it acts as a sleeve even just across the middle where the dingy would hit would possibly solve this, I assume it is exposed but just behind the rear bulkhead not further back in space as it were.

Smooth Cruiser
Posts: 583
Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 1:51 am
Location: Brisbane

Tie rods

Post by Smooth Cruiser » Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:03 pm

mahnamahna wrote:If your tie rod is steel (SS or Galv) tube then a slightly oversize PVC tube (glassed on to boat and completely encased in glass to stop it cracking if hit) over it so it acts as a sleeve even just across the middle where the dingy would hit would possibly solve this, I assume it is exposed but just behind the rear bulkhead not further back in space as it were.


It has to be more than slightly oversize - the tie rod moves out from the boat by at least a few inches when the tillers are on full lock and then moves close to the boat again when straight ahead - anyone building in a fix for this would need to keep this in consideration!!

northerncat
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Tie rods

Post by northerncat » Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:17 am

if you articulate it like james and i then it'll onl;y move about 30mm

sean

Jim
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 8:25 am
Location: Cairns

Tie rods

Post by Jim » Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:30 am

Mine doesn't move forward and back at all, just from side to side. It is fully enclosed though. Can check it out in members multis.

Jim.

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